regfootball

is yours a GXP? I drove an XL7 a couple weeks ago (semi close cousin) and I couldn't wait to get out of it. I hope the Torrent is much better. I always hated the old Vue and I hated the XL7 even more.

FWIW, i don't think people in NA would accept rebadged Opels as Pontiacs. It sounds like without Zeta, Pontiac had no backup plan. I really think there is a place for Chevy (to fight low aspiring Asian offerings), Saturn (vs. VW and Honda with Opels), and I really do think there is a place for Buick and Pontiac but not if Pontiac is mere rebadges. And for Buick to go the way of Buick China also is astray. I don't think Buick and Pontiac need many models, they just need to be unique and special. Problem is standalone BPG dealers need volume to survive and this is where the FWD clones and rebadges come in. Until GM fixes is sales channels, this will be a big problem. Like it or not, Saturn has the ability to have the most unique offerings in NA here.....they will be shared with Opel and not many Saturn dealers share floor with Chevy or BPG. Pontiac has Chrysler to blame for that overreaction to RWD. Fine if that would have stayed but expensive gas fixed that. Now Pontiac is scrambling. Is the next G6 Alpha or Epsilon 2? How long does the G8 stay, and on Zeta?

f-cking TWINS can't score a Fking run when their number five starter only gives up ONE RUN

some folks are prude little prissies what can you say

if GM pulled their head out of their ass they could sell the snot out of 9-3's right now because of their awesome mpg. but the pricing is a huge problem and the fact that they pretty much won't lease them out cheap if at all anymore.

i passed up a buttload of incentives, as well as a 2k competitive lease end, mainly due to skittishness about my work, but i am dying to see if they bring back that extra 2k incentive. that was hard to leave on the table. my dad is convinced you will see some serious incentives now till the end of the year. he says this is beginning of automakers getting desperate.

agreed. the CC is really nice.

still no doggie in the aztek yet.... GRRRRR

if they can cram a solstice or w-body with a v8, they can an alpha. stop worrying. although the question could be asked, is the time right for GM to design and new aluminum, compact pushrod v8? I prefer OHC, but this is an interesting question. and a DI v6 twin turbo would do just as good a job.....

the one aspect that is real is the major loss of value in people's assets they have worked so hard to attain. home values which have really dropped, 20, 25% or more. Equity=gone. Stocks, mutual funds etc. I know a gentlemen who retired who might have to go back to work because his stocks he was going to live on have declined so bad lately. We've stripped our avegage folks of all their assets and their earning power. People I know are losing jobs left and right (I might even be there soon). This f@#king eight years of hell and incompetence from a leadership standpoint can't end fast enough.

nissan's CVT has become their ace in the hole.

the routan interior is possibly the nicest and simplest of all the minivans. still bulky and dowdy. there is really nice soft touch plastic on the dash top. the doors etc. are the same as the T&C so there's no improvement there. the leather, same deal, its T&C spec mostly. the sliding center console and switchgear is all Chrysler mostly but to be honest I liked it. The dash shifter is ok but feels Detroit cheap in operation even if the leather on the knob is nice. The position of it did not bother me like I thought it would. So no, its not 'teutonic' aside from the really nice dash top. At the same time it is a desirable upgrade from the Dodge. Those who like the Sienna will probably think the Sienna is still nicer. Its definitely nicer than the Kia. The gauges are perfect and the view is panaramic. The seats are a little unshapely, i hope they fix that. It was fun hustling the van at high speeds on cloverleafs. Seriously, the Routan is nearly as nimble as my Taurus X, and even while still feeling a bit top heavy, is more athletic than many of the large crossovers I drove. Of course, this was the SEL. I had driven the 4.0 Pacifica with 6 speed before and knew it was a nice powertrain, easily the equal of other vehicles like this. My only reservation is it sometimes delays a downshift....no biggie. I couldn't figure out how the manual shift mode worked with the weird shifter placement. The Pacifica got a bad rap as a crossover but truth is if you can find one with the 4.0 and get a deal on it, its a sweet powertrain at a low price. Honda is upheld as the best van but I disagree. The honda rides hard and noisy, feels fragile on bumps, has a terrible interior, and all of that. I would take the Routan with 4.0 over the Honda every time. Personally I think the Odyssey is kind of crappy. Now I actually might take the Grand Caravan 3.8 out for a spin. VW might have scored a hit here. The van looks way better than its Chrylser brethren, and has a good ad campaign and lease deals out of the chute. This might be the van that makes vans cool again, for those who are too snobby to drive Asian or American brands.

the wall street meltdown is a natural disaster of epic proportions.

excellent! congrats.

congrats, blu! glad you went for the stick...I've been looking at a car with stick and tonight i tell this to my better half (who does know how to drive one) and she balked at the idea now. So I may not join the stick parade again, but I am glad you did.

i test drove a routan on friday. really nice van. i should post a writeup...always need more time

and no one will have any money to buy cars like these with our financial meltdown...LOL

oh, mine will be had for much less than that!

there is no crime in loving a creampuff cruiser.........

the saturn logo flat out sucks balls. how feminine of a logo can you get? One thing is for sure, when i pick up my astra, i'll need to start shopping to debadge the saturn tag off the front.

this falls under the 'they have covered every possible version of this on GMI' thread........ LMAO what the heck, everyone has a version of how GM should be, and it changes daily. It's fun.

EEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWWWWWWWEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

how saturn would be perceived differently if we had all the corsa, astra, insignia, and zafira models available in EU.

yes, in this case, if they don't get it, we'll become a 100% import nation. but they better make good on paying it back.

if she becomes VP, its going to be bizarre hearing on the nightly news how her yearly vagina check went. but as good journalists, i am sure they feel the public needs to know if her vagina is fit for presidential rigors.