G. David Felt

Interesting comparison between the 2008 Tesla Roadster 1.0 and the 2017 Tesla Roadster 2.0 Tesla Roadster 2008: 248 hp 270 Nm 53 kWh 244 miles (393 km) 0 — 60 mph: 3.9 sec Top speed: 125 mph Tesla Roadster 2020: 1,500 hp 10,000 Nm 200 kWh 620 miles (1000 km) 0 — 60 mph: 1.9 sec Top speed +250 mph

To those that say we are still very dirty, here is the latest chart showing our North America Energy use and from what sources, very interesting: This is our GCD emissions and is pretty interesting to see how much we have increased output that is affecting the planet: Clearly we can change and not just in auto use but elsewhere to improve our living and the footprint we leave on this planet.

So Toyota was an early investor to a tune of $50 Million back in 2010 just before the IPO of Tesla. They have quietly sold off all their stock in June for $538 million as they are now a true competitor with their own dedicated EV division. Early on the Toyota Rav4 EV was a Tesla Powertrain with a Toyota body. According to a CNN report that partnership crashed at the end of 2014 due to a culture clash of Japan wanting to go mass market with cheap EV's and Tesla CEO Musk saying they can be profitable as a high end auto company and not wanting to allow toyota to keep using their tech resulting in a wind down and eventual sell off of Tesla Stock. CNN Story In 2013 Forbes did a formal review of Tesla and said the company was way overvalued and with their focus by CEO Musk selling S class cars for $80-$110,000 dollars they were bleeding money as each S class car was costing $1.1 million to make and this was in 2013. Forbes said at the time if Tesla could sell 40,000 S class cars for 2013, that would still leave a manufacturing cost of $550,000 per car. Musk then came out and said that their Gen 3 technology would allow them to create a less luxury car priced at $35,000 and be more profitable than any other car company. The global community grabbed it and pushed the stock value up even more. Forbes does imply that Musk is an outstanding Marketing person, but a terrible communicator of the real facts. Forbes shows all the math in their story and states for 2013 Tesla stock trades at 117 times it's P/E ratio. In 2014 banks were stating that Tesla would be about 88 times valuation. Tesla then took to massive leasing of the Tesla S car which inflates Tesla revenue and understates their debt balance sheet. Even with Tax and ZEV credits where Tesla makes a hefty amount of about half a billion a year, the company is on a Utopian goal that is not sustainable. End result is Forbes is just as baffled by the ability to stay alive bleeding money. They clearly state it is a CULT Stock where reason is thrown out the window. Forbes Story Business Insider wrote this story in July 2017 and titled it: "It might be time for Tesla to get out of the car business!" and they would be right in stating it I believe. End result with all the profitable cash heavy auto companies, Tesla is about to be dumped into the deep end where they cannot swim with their current massive debt load even if they do start to deliver the Tesla 3 in quantity. They blame it on a couple of things, 1) A victim of Musk's vision. 2) A business for the Nutty. 3) Hard to change course as Tesla does a Joint Venture with a Chinese partner to build auto's in China and the clash that is about to happen. End result, not a financially exciting business to get into, but a financially depressing black hole that is sucking up money faster than most can understand. All the stories clearly highlight the impact Tesla has had on the global auto business. One thing that I have realized in looking at this is that Tesla as a sell off company is really only valued between $5 to $10 billion at most and that still will not cover all the debt they have incurred. Not a matter of IF, but a matter of WHEN Tesla will have to go bankrupt or be sold I believe.

Like the looks both exterior and interior. Clearly copied some of the vibe from Land Rover as I see that in the over all body of this CUV. Exterior, I am so happy they clipped the retro Lincoln grill and finally gave it a 21st century look to move forward on. My only real concern is FORD's poor quality record as I wonder about just how rusty this auto will be coming off the assembly line. I wish them all the best and truly hope this can be a fresh start for them as a real luxury competitor and not just a tarted up FORD. If we see a FORD equal to this with the blue oval on it, game over for them ever really being in the luxury game. Wonder how long before they bring out alternative powertrain options?

Soooooo, while we can debate how long the ability for a company to live in the red and be a darling of wall street, as I posted above. Musk is in no real position to bail Tesla out either since most of his wealth is tied up in stock of the two companies he owns. Yes I would like to see them survive and especially as an American car company. With that said, does GM need to buy them? Not really sure about that as I think the next two auto's they bring out will be based on the BOLT platform and everything else will be on version 2.0 of that said platform. I suspect that 2.0 platform will be a true EV or PHEV / Hybrid platform to further reduce costs for a global platform. Based on GMs presentation to the financial community, they have 7 SUVs, 5 CUVs, 2 cars and 2 vans for EV/PHEV/Hybrid. GM will surpass Tesla by 2020 I believe.

Happy Gobbel Gobbel Day to all C&G Members and Guests! Wishing everyone a great relaxing day no matter who your with or where you are. I hope everyone can have some enjoyable relaxing down time around the world!

According to the details of his $20.1 Billion networth as of Sept 7th 2017, 82% of it is stock as he controls 51% of Space X and a large chunk of Tesla. that means roughly 16.4 billion is stock so he really is only worth 3.6 billion if you look at cash and other assets. He is on record as sinking almost every penny he owns into these two companies. So if they die, he pretty much is wiped out.

Burn baby Burn should be Tesla's new slogan!

This is not true as every state is different, in Washington state, you pay all your taxes and fees at the time you buy your car, so an ad like this is deceptive and would not be allowed as taxes, fees, title, etc. can vary depending on the final agreed purchase price of the auto. So you're saying in Europe prices are fixed, there is no dickering you just pay what they advertise? Interesting,

Very cool auto, reminds me of the AMC Eagles. An auto way ahead of it's time.

Interesting, just saw this on Green Car Report that NextEV from China that built their Nio EV SUV based on Tesla patents has secured from various sources both in China and the US over $1 billion to build and ship their first RWD EV SUV. The company claims they will have Toyota Cost and quality with Tesla battery range. http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1113856_chinese-electric-car-startup-nio-gets-1-billion-in-funding-report

I normally would too, but the SRX lack of legroom in the rear compared to the Envision makes the difference.

I thought they reminded me of Volvo.

When you do get back out, check out one of the Theater Breweries. Some great places to enjoy custom micro beer and a movie with food. https://www.travelportland.com/article/portland-brew-n-view-theaters/ https://www.thrillist.com/entertainment/portland/portland-s-best-theater-pubs-beer-movie-theaters Been to most of them, course as a fan of Terminator, I have a fondness for Mission Theater. Hollywood Theater is a blast also. Cool 70mm films are still shown there.

Some awesome places to visit on Couch Street. Named after John H. Couch the treasure and a sailor of Portland OR. Couch Beer is pretty good there too since there are a bunch of micro brews in that area. I agree with everyone that modern auto's are a pain in the ass to P - Park. Another reason I love my SUV's.

That is why you have higher ground clearance. My daughter used to be afraid of parallel parking her Durango. I taught her to just pull in, take the front wheel up onto the sidewalk / curb and then slowly drop it off back onto the street. Parallel parked in record time. She never has a problem and loves how easy it is to do. Yea, many are not able to P - Park, but I consider myself the exception rather than the norm. Just drive up, drop off and done being parked close.

Trumpchi Auto brand? Really? Talk about coming into an Auto market with a looser of a name. They so need to rethink the marketing and branding of their auto's. They would be better off just merging with FCA or buying them out and using the US branded names as a minimal select group would buy a Trumpchi brand not to mention I am sure Trump would sue about his name being used.

EXCITEMENT! Cool to see the whole release of this bad boy and if it really will live up to the potential Excitement!

Cool

I would rather have it as an option. I myself see no need for it. Proper planning makes these electronic options just that optional and for the most part lazy people features. Driving is a privilege you earn and you should be actively involved in all you do even when you use your auto to haul. Right now we have way to many nanny devices that has created a very lazy group of drivers.

EV Tow Trucks will tow the Tow truck, just like Ford Diesel tows the Ford Diesel. So much for that one.

Yo Willis, why you yelling?

True, so ridiculously overpriced.

You do not know that it is way too much for a Kia, your showing your badge snob as I would say that 60% of the MB auto's are way overpriced. Everything from the MB A class to the C class is way overpriced for what you get and in that regards much of the E and S class too in comparison to much better deals from other makers.

As such, the quiet as a tomb cars will be welcomed by those that bought them, aka camry, etc. as the less maintenance is what these people want. By the auto, drive it or let it self drive and ignore everything else till they get to their destination. I am willing to bet that you could take all the ICE bland auto's that sell so well and change the Powertrain to EV and no one would notice or care. They might notice that they never have some of the basic maintenance to deal with.