ATS/CT6 short take

[ccap41]

For those of you who were following my thread questioning the idea of buying an ATS this is already over there.. but for those of you who don't give two $h!s about my buying decisions I thought I'd throw this somewhere where people can just hear my opinions on a couple sweet-ass cars..imo.

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Well, I drove an ATS and I sat in a CT6(and fiddled with the infotainment stuffs).

 

ATS drove awesome. I loved how tight and nimble it felt. The trans felt a little snappy from gear to gear but not in a bad way, just in a way that I'm not used to in autos(you could feel the up-shifts upon light throttle application). But I've also never driven a sporty auto..well I guess my C350 was in a similar category just 7 years older. Just about everything about how it drove I really really liked. I immediately felt comfortable behind the wheel and I think some of that is I'm just more at home in smaller vehicles where I can feel the proportions much better than larger, "airier" vehicles. What I mean by that is, for instance, The space in the cabin from driver to the bottom of the windshield and pillars..just feels wait more "airy" in my Escape. The ATS, not so much. But I liked it. I felt more connected to the car right off the bat. Back seats were fine for me but I know I'm on the average side of people so anybody larger might have issues. Luckily for me I don't have many friends over 6' anyway. Plus, I've dealt with Mustangs in the past so having 4 doors is a plus already. I did find it odd that sitting in the back seat the roof was very low. Low to the point that the back 6inches of the roof-line actually have a cut out for taller riders, but my head was already occupying that space(not to the ceiling but awfully close for being 5'8")  so I really am not sure IF a 6' passenger could sit in the back.

 

The one thing that might actually be a deal breaker is the damn fake buttons for radio/HVAC. I honestly don't know how that was "okay'd". I didn't think the ones for the HVAC were really that bad. They were in good locations and responded 95% of the time I touched it. It was the ones by the radio( vehicle did NOT have CUE) that I just turned the volume knob and twice my pinky brushed the "radio" "button" and went to AM and then had to fiddle with it to get it back to FM. But that was really the only thing I didn't like, but I didn't like it a lot. I'd like to get some seat time w/ CUE and see how that is. I also realize that once I familiarize myself with the car I would probably just be using the steering wheel controls anyway but just the fact that it would take waaaay more getting used to that it should is kind of gear grinding.

 

CT6. F, that car is sexy in person. The dealer had one on the lot(2 pre-ordered and sold already) and this was their first to just be as regular inventory. This was a "lowly" version ringing in at only 61k so I couldn't imagine bringing that up to 90k+ w/ more bells and whistles(other than the TT3.0 and AWD which this did not have - obviously). I freakin' LOVED how the infotainment system navigated and looked and worked and everything, lol. The touch pad that works like a mouse..and you can feel through it where you're moving the "mouse". You place your finger on it and when moving left, right, up, or down it as tiny pulses recognizing which way you're moving your finger so you can probably navigate the screen with less effort while driving. It's just awesome. either touch the screen or use the touch pad which how I placed my thumb on it, fit ergonomically perfect to me from where I set the seat up to. No stretching or too cramped and bending my arm. The car was a little big for me but honestly, from the driver's seat it didn't feel too bad. I felt like I knew the proportions fairly well from the driver's seat and that's a very comforting feeling to me which I don't get in many vehicles but the outward visibility was superb as it was in the ATS. 

 

Oh yeah, I also remembered looking back from the driver's seat and seeing USB and AC outlets where the middle person would be sitting, between their knees. I really liked that because, for the most part, nobody sits there, and they're built in so it keeps the look clean, aaaaaand they were pretty well hidden because they were under the "butt cushion" part of the seat.

[Suaviloquent]

I wouldn't say the CT6 is sexy. I like the way it looks, but it just doesn't measure up to the Jaguar XJ in terms of looks. But it does beat anything from Audi or BMW in looks.

 

The interior is great for the price, but NOT worthy of what I would expect a top of the line Cadillac to be. With the CT8 in the wind....we'll see where they go next.

 

If they had used the black mesh grille from the concepts and a smaller crest it'd easily look $10,000 more expensive. Seriously.

 

I would say an S-Class is not a car they people would think is "sexy" than "elegant" so I would exclude it from that kind of comparison.

[Cmicasa the Great]

I agree with U CCap.. .the CT6 is effin SEXY. Sexy as f@#k. Personally I think the CT6 makes the 7Series, S-Class, A8, LS460, and especially the weirdly proportioned Jag XJ look like yesterday's fish wrapper.

[ccap41]

The CT6 has some lines and creases that make it more "sexy" than "elegant" in my books. The SClass is along the elegant line as it has more flowing curves(but not bubbly) in my books.

Granted, I've never sat in an S Class, let alone a 120k brand new one but for the size of the car I thought the interior was pretty awesome. But, like I said, I haven't sat in an S Class or a 7 Series.. Or A8 or whatever letter Jag is this size. But at 61k other than having the 3.6 which I think I would want an engine with gobs of low-end to cruise rather than a peaky 3.6, it was great. Again, I haven't fiddled with the infotainment units in the other cars but I loved how well this responded, was controllable, looked, and was touch screen and had a "mouse-like" pad.

I don't know what the price gap is to get that with the 3.0tt but it would be tough to not get that in a dark or slate grey, agree with you on the grill - change it, and the OEM dark wheels to go with it..over the comparably priced competition. If money meant nothing an AMG 63/65 just because power but the price is outrageous for something like that.

Casa, have you gotten to take one for a spin yet?

[Suaviloquent]

Ehhh... the CT6 I guess number 2 in terms of sexiness. Okay, I'll deem it sexy IMO. But look at the Jag man. It ain't reliable. But it's lickable, voluptuous, one purty kitty.

 

I agree with U CCap.. .the CT6 is effin SEXY. Sexy as f@#k. Personally I think the CT6 makes the 7Series, S-Class, A8, LS460, and especially the weirdly proportioned Jag XJ look like yesterday's fish wrapper.

 

Funny you call it weirdly proportioned. $h! man, even I admit I'm a General Moron (in fact, I am a "Sir" General Moron, but do you really have to try to beat me at it?!!

[balthazar]

The Jag XJ I would agree has some 'off' proportions. It has a LOT of front overhang that I find inelegant, and the greenhouse appears distended to the rear too far.
Once you move away from those cues, it's rather generic. I mean it's still a solid B grade, but…. eh.

 

This looks FAR more expensive IMO :

 

[Drew Dowdell]

On the buttons, I notice that people often put their fingers in the wrong spot and only actually hit the proper spot by accident.  That seems to lead to a lot of the confusion.  You're not actually supposed to be touching the silver part at all (well you can, but that's not where the sensor is).... you're supposed to touch the icon above the silver line..... I found that once I changed my thinking on it, I never had an issue with the buttons. 

[Suaviloquent]

Well, I'm not one for 'critical' design analysis. I just say what looks what to me.

 

And this is what I like about the XJ's looks "Those sleek headlights are a highlight, as is the seamless transition from the sloping roofline to the rear windshield and again to the trunklid that rises to meet it. Sure, rear visibility with a high trunklid isn’t very good, but that trunklid is part of a memorable exterior design."

 

Though I would still BUY the CT6 before anything else in this class of vehicle. 

 

And the XJ is not by any means generic. It's PURE Jaguar Sexifulll styling. It is a true flagship in terms of its interior as well. 

 

The Cadillac is nice...again, I would put my money on it. But it's not an advancement of Art and Science. It's just a larger CTS on the outside.

 

Besides. The I don't want to get into a debate over lines and creases. If you have a clean look, it's called bland. If you add too many like Lexus it's an abomination. If you add a little, it's called generic or derivative. Dammit.

 

[balthazar]

The last Jaguar that felt 'pure' to me was the unloved S :

 

[Drew Dowdell]

The last Jaguar that felt 'pure' to me was the unloved S :

 

 

I still love those.... they can be had for so cheap

[Suaviloquent]

Well, I'm not so sure about that... what defines design "purity" ?

 

Usually an unbridled commitment to many design cues, some of which become garish over time.

 

Ultimately it leads to stagnation - unless you have a brand image that is simply impenetrable to outside competitors, such that no one can steal buyers from you. That's what. 

[balthazar]

If you have a clean look, it's called bland. If you add too many like Lexus it's an abomination. If you add a little, it's called generic or derivative. Dammit.

Yep, that's pretty much the way it goes.

[ccap41]

On the buttons, I notice that people often put their fingers in the wrong spot and only actually hit the proper spot by accident.  That seems to lead to a lot of the confusion.  You're not actually supposed to be touching the silver part at all (well you can, but that's not where the sensor is).... you're supposed to touch the icon above the silver line..... I found that once I changed my thinking on it, I never had an issue with the buttons.

Oh yeah I don't think the HVAC "buttons" we an issue at all. I thought that it was kind of funny that a lot of the issues with that is people try and use the silver as a button not the icon.

My issue was(in a vehicle w/o CUE) simply turning the volume knob my pinky very easily came into contact with the "radio" button changing to the AM presets. Just poor placement because i don't have a big bulky hand and I don't consider myself careless or sloppy it was just at a bad location compared to the Radio knob. That's why I need to fiddle around with CUE because it is clearly layed out different.

[Cmicasa the Great]

The CT6 has some lines and creases that make it more "sexy" than "elegant" in my books. The SClass is along the elegant line as it has more flowing curves(but not bubbly) in my books.

Granted, I've never sat in an S Class, let alone a 120k brand new one but for the size of the car I thought the interior was pretty awesome. But, like I said, I haven't sat in an S Class or a 7 Series.. Or A8 or whatever letter Jag is this size. But at 61k other than having the 3.6 which I think I would want an engine with gobs of low-end to cruise rather than a peaky 3.6, it was great. Again, I haven't fiddled with the infotainment units in the other cars but I loved how well this responded, was controllable, looked, and was touch screen and had a "mouse-like" pad.

I don't know what the price gap is to get that with the 3.0tt but it would be tough to not get that in a dark or slate grey, agree with you on the grill - change it, and the OEM dark wheels to go with it..over the comparably priced competition. If money meant nothing an AMG 63/65 just because power but the price is outrageous for something like that.

Casa, have you gotten to take one for a spin yet?

 

 

The CT6? No.. I have sat in and messed around with one, but my dealer hasn't gotten one and my other dealer with one is about 40 minutes away. I have considered riding down there, but feared I'd get there.. see a White Diamond CT6 Platinum.. and end up trading Rose in on the spot.

 

As for the interior of the S-Class and 7 Series. They are, in their customized forms, a step above the Cadillac's BUT ONLY in customized trim. If U get into a normal S550, for instance, U will see that the CT6 Plat. is not only on par with it in terms of materials and design, but possibly rivals it. 

[Cmicasa the Great]

Ehhh... the CT6 I guess number 2 in terms of sexiness. Okay, I'll deem it sexy IMO. But look at the Jag man. It ain't reliable. But it's lickable, voluptuous, one purty kitty.

 

I agree with U CCap.. .the CT6 is effin SEXY. Sexy as f@#k. Personally I think the CT6 makes the 7Series, S-Class, A8, LS460, and especially the weirdly proportioned Jag XJ look like yesterday's fish wrapper.

 

Funny you call it weirdly proportioned. $h! man, even I admit I'm a General Moron (in fact, I am a "Sir" General Moron, but do you really have to try to beat me at it?!!

 

 

 

Dude.. U don't even register half the time. I just think your tastes suck.. and that Jag looks about as "money" or "sexy" as a ham sandwich. Not to mention the design is OLD. It looks older in fact, to me, than the real XJ it replaced. The one that looked like it was designed specifically for the wealth jet-setter. This one looks like it was designed by the same guy who designed the 2010 Lincoln MKS

 

This was a Jag XJ

 

[Cmicasa the Great]

On the buttons, I notice that people often put their fingers in the wrong spot and only actually hit the proper spot by accident.  That seems to lead to a lot of the confusion.  You're not actually supposed to be touching the silver part at all (well you can, but that's not where the sensor is).... you're supposed to touch the icon above the silver line..... I found that once I changed my thinking on it, I never had an issue with the buttons. 

 

 

Learned this on my first outing with CUE in an Escalade. Once I learned that the silver slivers with simply "markers" denoting where the sensor was.. I never had an issue again. Coincidentally.. my almost 16 year old daughter, upon her first time getting in my V.. having never used CUE before..  turns the headset on.. pairs her phone.. "cues up" Spotify.. slides her finger across the volume sensor.. and commences in blaring Beyonce. It was of no never-mind to her that OLD PEOPLE had had trouble enough figuring out CUE that it screwed Cadillac ranking in JD Power's issues per vehicle report last year. Her only words before me telling her to turn it down was;  "Slick..." 

[Suaviloquent]

No, not even the Platinum CT6 has an interior close to that of the S-Class base model. It's just a pipe dream. Also, Cadillac had in the pre-production Platinum cars an airbag cover that was leather, and for production cars they took it out.

 

There is no resolution of the fact that the CT6 CANNOT compete with the S-Class. Why the hell would JDN say it's "NOT a flagship."

 

Sheesh.

[ccap41]

I think the 30k price gap says a lot too.. 

 

Cadillac will make a true flagship to compete with the S Class eventually. And to me... the CT6 is freakin awesome. It would hard not to at least involve it in a decision making process. But I guess when you're spending that kind of money the decision is made before even seeing what each make has to offer. The buyer either leaves the house thinking "I'm getting a new Benz today" or "I'm getting a new Caddy today". 

[Drew Dowdell]

No, not even the Platinum CT6 has an interior close to that of the S-Class base model. It's just a pipe dream. Also, Cadillac had in the pre-production Platinum cars an airbag cover that was leather, and for production cars they took it out.

 

There is no resolution of the fact that the CT6 CANNOT compete with the S-Class. Why the hell would JDN say it's "NOT a flagship."

 

Sheesh.

 

Cadillac's flagship remains the Escalade for now. 

[Suaviloquent]

That's not the point. They saved no expense for the platform, but then when it came time to actually make the great dare, they floundered on the interior. Like I can't believe how we were all led to believe it would be the car to bring Cadillac to the top. It just isn't that car. And NO it deos not rival an S-Class in any way, shape or form. The S-Class is just out of reach in every CT6 configuration. Unless they fix the interior, put back the same level of craftsmanship from the Fleetwood Brougham D'Elegance, and get the V8 back as well. 

 

Here's a review that I thought was far more REALISTIC about the capabilities of the CT6. Sure it's a real savings over the competition. But why muddle in that territory? The marketing guys have to start asking the top brass, why the f*** do we always price ourselves below the competition? It hurts their overall design execution, and leads to compromise. 

 

http://www.automobilemag.com/news/2016-cadillac-ct6-review/

 

Also, I just see this car being rather superfluous if they have another sedan above it. I mean, sure Mercedes makes the Maybach....but they're essentially the same car, even majority of the styling is the same. 

[Suaviloquent]

 

No, not even the Platinum CT6 has an interior close to that of the S-Class base model. It's just a pipe dream. Also, Cadillac had in the pre-production Platinum cars an airbag cover that was leather, and for production cars they took it out.

 

There is no resolution of the fact that the CT6 CANNOT compete with the S-Class. Why the hell would JDN say it's "NOT a flagship."

 

Sheesh.

 

Cadillac's flagship remains the Escalade for now. 

 

 

Which is perfectly fine. I don't think there has to be a rigid template where the top sedan is the flagship vehicle. But I seriously hope that Cadillac does not ingrain in their philosophy that it is beneath them to build a very luxurious interior. Unless they're making a Tesla competitor at Cadillac (which they aren't - admission by their marketing guy), no one is fooled that the CT6 is a flagship vehicle worthy of the Cadillac name in every facet.

[Drew Dowdell]

The mission of the CT6 changed part of the way through.... and when Cadillac does to an S-class level car, they'll still use the same platform most likely.

 

The CT6 is a driver's car for someone who wants a big car but doesn't want to sacrifice handling.   It's a 6-series or CLS with rear headroom and enough space for some luggage.   In terms of space, it's a bit like the old DTS, except now it has the agility of a 5-series or better. 

[ccap41]

There was a comment on that page that I thought was worthy of rehashing..

 

"Why are they comparing this car to the S class, 7 Series and A8 when Cadillac explicitly states that it is not meant to compete with those cars?  Cadillac states that a competitor to that class will not arrive until the end of the decade.  This article seems like a childish attempt at proving that the car does not compete with cars it was not designed to compete with."

[Suaviloquent]

Which is why I find it stupid when then said fans of GM start saying it's a rival to an S-Class, 7 Series or A8. In any way even. C'mon, I may be a General Moron, but I ain't buying that crap. Well I am inclined to buy a CT6. But I ain't buying that crap.

[Suaviloquent]

The mission of the CT6 changed part of the way through.... and when Cadillac does to an S-class level car, they'll still use the same platform most likely.

 

The CT6 is a driver's car for someone who wants a big car but doesn't want to sacrifice handling.   It's a 6-series or CLS with rear headroom and enough space for some luggage.   In terms of space, it's a bit like the old DTS, except now it has the agility of a 5-series or better. 

 

The article from Automobile ultimately says it's not a night and day difference though with the large luxo-barges as it should be.

 

Look, I think of the priorities of the person buying this car, and then I look at the length of it...the only thing that I think is truly nice is the all-wheel steering, because it's probably the only thing that truly is a benefit for handling....the rest of it...think of how the XTS is driven. Will anyone drive the CT6 in any way different from the XTS? So in that sense, is that apparent handling advantage "useful" for them, or creating value?

 

Because if they instead stuffed more money into the interior, then I think they'd have truly blitzed the large sedan segment.

[Drew Dowdell]

 

The mission of the CT6 changed part of the way through.... and when Cadillac does to an S-class level car, they'll still use the same platform most likely.

 

The CT6 is a driver's car for someone who wants a big car but doesn't want to sacrifice handling.   It's a 6-series or CLS with rear headroom and enough space for some luggage.   In terms of space, it's a bit like the old DTS, except now it has the agility of a 5-series or better. 

 

The article from Automobile ultimately says it's not a night and day difference though with the large luxo-barges as it should be.

 

Oh?  That wasn't my takeaway

 

 

 

Biggest surprise: the jewel in the new CT6 lineup is the rear-drive, turbo-four base car. This version feels distinctly different from its V-6, AWD siblings: it’s more agile, more fun, with livelier steering and an agreeable sizzle under the hood. Never expected it, but the bantam four-banger is amazingly refined and eager. You’ll smile as you gun this CT6 from corner to corner. You may even chortle. At $59,390 in Luxury trim, this version delivers value with a wallop. And it returns an estimated 22/31 city/highway mpg. Seriously, if you’re shopping for a CT6, don’t overlook the little guy.

 

Most likely, it's just the suspension tuning on the platinum model. 

[G. David Felt]

That rocks about the CT6

[Cmicasa the Great]

That's not the point. They saved no expense for the platform, but then when it came time to actually make the great dare, they floundered on the interior. Like I can't believe how we were all led to believe it would be the car to bring Cadillac to the top. It just isn't that car. And NO it deos not rival an S-Class in any way, shape or form. The S-Class is just out of reach in every CT6 configuration. Unless they fix the interior, put back the same level of craftsmanship from the Fleetwood Brougham D'Elegance, and get the V8 back as well. 

 

 

 

Of course the first question I'd ask is if they do all those things.. will U ante up the base price of $90K to buy one? Doubt it.. for a bunch of reasons, but mostly because U are full of $h!. The CT6 is an S-Class competitor where it counts.. and for someone to say that it can't compete because of a few minor details, when the $25K+ price difference is brought into play is ridiculous and quite frankly stupid. (The last part because I think U suck.. and U are a f@#kin blowhard.)  

 

The V8 availability... is the only thing U say that has any validity. The interesting part is that my top of the line CTS has as nice of an interior as the S-Class, and addresses the issues in the interior of the less expensive CT6 that U speak. But alas.. there is the solution, and the issue; Should Cadillac had come right out the box with CTS-V (read $10K-35K more) type amenities in a car that had to prove itself.. or waited one year and put out a new V8 encased in the car that was on the market already SHOWING AND PROVING?

[Cmicasa the Great]

There was a comment on that page that I thought was worthy of rehashing..

 

"Why are they comparing this car to the S class, 7 Series and A8 when Cadillac explicitly states that it is not meant to compete with those cars?  Cadillac states that a competitor to that class will not arrive until the end of the decade.  This article seems like a childish attempt at proving that the car does not compete with cars it was not designed to compete with."

 

 

NO.. what it is the fact that in reality the S-Class and 7Series are not as far out in the galaxy as some who have very little time in that would believe. People create mental blockages based on what is the accepted or time-honored norm. Thus no car will be as great as the M5 despite the fact that several cars kick the living $h! out it in more ways than just performance.. or the Germans are the epitome of handling yet.. we all actually no its BULL$h! in 2016.. yet we still say it.

 

I take an AWD 403HP TTV6 standard car costing $83K put it up against a RWD 449HP TTV8 standard car costing $10K more.. and the thing that some fool comes at me with as a reason why the S-Class is better is because of a few trinkets on the interior feel less refined. Its as if that idiot forgot.. its $10K less. The issues aren't even $10K less in worth.. $1000 most at that.

[Suaviloquent]

 

That's not the point. They saved no expense for the platform, but then when it came time to actually make the great dare, they floundered on the interior. Like I can't believe how we were all led to believe it would be the car to bring Cadillac to the top. It just isn't that car. And NO it does not rival an S-Class in any way, shape or form. The S-Class is just out of reach in every CT6 configuration. Unless they fix the interior, put back the same level of craftsmanship from the Fleetwood Brougham D'Elegance, and get the V8 back as well. 

 

 

 

Of course the first question I'd ask is if they do all those things.. will U ante up the base price of $90K to buy one? Doubt it.. for a bunch of reasons, but mostly because U are full of $h!. The CT6 is an S-Class competitor where it counts.. and for someone to say that it can't compete because of a few minor details, when the $25K+ price difference is brought into play is ridiculous and quite frankly stupid. (The last part because I think U suck.. and U are a f@#kin blowhard.)

 

The V8 availability... is the only thing U say that has any validity. The interesting part is that my top of the line CTS has as nice of an interior as the S-Class, and addresses the issues in the interior of the less expensive CT6 that U speak. But alas.. there is the solution, and the issue; Should Cadillac had come right out the box with CTS-V (read $10K-35K more) type amenities in a car that had to prove itself.. or waited one year and put out a new V8 encased in the car that was on the market already SHOWING AND PROVING?

 

 

Insulting me won't win you any points. I think many Cadillac fans are ultimately blind as to how the firm can actually capture people who don't like the firm. The only thing that would make tehm show respect is complete dominance, even in the interior.

 

I love Cadillac. But it's stupid people who think Cadillac has bottled lightning that need to realize the most advanced chassis in the world won't save them from ultimate scrutiny over the interior. That and before JD came in it was promised it would defy all critics.

 

The price difference isn't the point, genius. I want Cadillac to CHARGE MORE. (READ THAT AGAIN) CHARGE MORE THAN MERCEDES, and while matching or exceeding that interior. And it can't even match it, at any price or trim level. Your top of the line CTS does not have as nice an interior as an S-Class. Damn well an Audi A6 is better. And no, you're opinion ain't worth jack $h!, because Cadillac should NEVER be a value for money company. They should just be the standard that no one can beat. It's that kind of thinking, that will lead Cadillac to success. But they have to have the best of everything. I think a separate engine family is just politically driven, has no basis if they judge the merits of their premium V8 already used in the Escalade. 

 

 

And anyhow, there's a huge marketing gamble, when someone proclaims their product to be world best but then charges bargain basement prices for it. Everyone knows that. 

[Suaviloquent]

 

There was a comment on that page that I thought was worthy of rehashing..

 

"Why are they comparing this car to the S class, 7 Series and A8 when Cadillac explicitly states that it is not meant to compete with those cars?  Cadillac states that a competitor to that class will not arrive until the end of the decade.  This article seems like a childish attempt at proving that the car does not compete with cars it was not designed to compete with."

 

 

NO.. what it is the fact that in reality the S-Class and 7Series are not as far out in the galaxy as some who have very little time in that would believe. People create mental blockages based on what is the accepted or time-honored norm. Thus no car will be as great as the M5 despite the fact that several cars kick the living $h! out it in more ways than just performance.. or the Germans are the epitome of handling yet.. we all actually no its BULL$h! in 2016.. yet we still say it.

 

I take an AWD 403HP TTV6 standard car costing $83K put it up against a RWD 449HP TTV8 standard car costing $10K more.. and the thing that some fool comes at me with as a reason why the S-Class is better is because of a few trinkets on the interior feel less refined. Its as if that idiot forgot.. its $10K less. The issues aren't even $10K less in worth.. $1000 most at that.

 

 

No they are not. Which baffles people as to why Cadillac cannot do the simple things of ensuring complete dominance. Why spent billions on the Omega platform, and then cut costs on the interior? That's the question they haven't answered. With the CT8 being up in the wind, it won't be answered for quite a while.

 

The first thing, before people even drive the car, is sit inside and take a long look. 

[Cmicasa the Great]

 

 

That's not the point. They saved no expense for the platform, but then when it came time to actually make the great dare, they floundered on the interior. Like I can't believe how we were all led to believe it would be the car to bring Cadillac to the top. It just isn't that car. And NO it does not rival an S-Class in any way, shape or form. The S-Class is just out of reach in every CT6 configuration. Unless they fix the interior, put back the same level of craftsmanship from the Fleetwood Brougham D'Elegance, and get the V8 back as well. 

 

 

 

Of course the first question I'd ask is if they do all those things.. will U ante up the base price of $90K to buy one? Doubt it.. for a bunch of reasons, but mostly because U are full of $h!. The CT6 is an S-Class competitor where it counts.. and for someone to say that it can't compete because of a few minor details, when the $25K+ price difference is brought into play is ridiculous and quite frankly stupid. (The last part because I think U suck.. and U are a f@#kin blowhard.)

 

The V8 availability... is the only thing U say that has any validity. The interesting part is that my top of the line CTS has as nice of an interior as the S-Class, and addresses the issues in the interior of the less expensive CT6 that U speak. But alas.. there is the solution, and the issue; Should Cadillac had come right out the box with CTS-V (read $10K-35K more) type amenities in a car that had to prove itself.. or waited one year and put out a new V8 encased in the car that was on the market already SHOWING AND PROVING?

 

 

Insulting me won't win you any points. I think many Cadillac fans are ultimately blind as to how the firm can actually capture people who don't like the firm. The only thing that would make tehm show respect is complete dominance, even in the interior.

 

I love Cadillac. But it's stupid people who think Cadillac has bottled lightning that need to realize the most advanced chassis in the world won't save them from ultimate scrutiny over the interior. That and before JD came in it was promised it would defy all critics.

 

The price difference isn't the point, genius. I want Cadillac to CHARGE MORE. (READ THAT AGAIN) CHARGE MORE THAN MERCEDES, and while matching or exceeding that interior. And it can't even match it, at any price or trim level. Your top of the line CTS does not have as nice an interior as an S-Class. Damn well an Audi A6 is better. And no, you're opinion ain't worth jack $h!, because Cadillac should NEVER be a value for money company. They should just be the standard that no one can beat. It's that kind of thinking, that will lead Cadillac to success. But they have to have the best of everything. I think a separate engine family is just politically driven, has no basis if they judge the merits of their premium V8 already used in the Escalade. 

 

 

And anyhow, there's a huge marketing gamble, when someone proclaims their product to be world best but then charges bargain basement prices for it. Everyone knows that. 

 

 

 

Insulting U is my sport of the today.. cause its raining geni.. no jack-ass. The idea in your head that charging more means best shows me that U really are naive. What makes it worse is that in your mind having the more advanced chassis in the world is second to having a leather cap over the airbag. Personally I would have no issue at all if the already stellar Alpha chassis under my CTS was given up for the, by your own admission, most advanced chassis in the world sitting under the CT6.. and all I had to do is give up.. the leather cap on my steering while and take a rubberized one. 

[Cmicasa the Great]

 

 

There was a comment on that page that I thought was worthy of rehashing..

 

"Why are they comparing this car to the S class, 7 Series and A8 when Cadillac explicitly states that it is not meant to compete with those cars?  Cadillac states that a competitor to that class will not arrive until the end of the decade.  This article seems like a childish attempt at proving that the car does not compete with cars it was not designed to compete with."

 

 

NO.. what it is the fact that in reality the S-Class and 7Series are not as far out in the galaxy as some who have very little time in that would believe. People create mental blockages based on what is the accepted or time-honored norm. Thus no car will be as great as the M5 despite the fact that several cars kick the living $h! out it in more ways than just performance.. or the Germans are the epitome of handling yet.. we all actually no its BULL$h! in 2016.. yet we still say it.

 

I take an AWD 403HP TTV6 standard car costing $83K put it up against a RWD 449HP TTV8 standard car costing $10K more.. and the thing that some fool comes at me with as a reason why the S-Class is better is because of a few trinkets on the interior feel less refined. Its as if that idiot forgot.. its $10K less. The issues aren't even $10K less in worth.. $1000 most at that.

 

 

No they are not. Which baffles people as to why Cadillac cannot do the simple things of ensuring complete dominance. Why spent billions on the Omega platform, and then cut costs on the interior? That's the question they haven't answered. With the CT8 being up in the wind, it won't be answered for quite a while.

 

The first thing, before people even drive the car, is sit inside and take a long look. 

 

 

 

 

The CT6 Platinum TTV6 is not the end of the line for the CT6, let alone the CT6+ and ++. Hey Cadillac.. what U should have done is push out the CT6 TTV8, CT7, and CT8 at the same time as U launched the rest of the CT6. U kno.. while U are still showing and proving. Ain't nothing better than putting out the best car in the world while not everyone is looking.

[rougeriver]

 

 

The mission of the CT6 changed part of the way through.... and when Cadillac does to an S-class level car, they'll still use the same platform most likely.

 

The CT6 is a driver's car for someone who wants a big car but doesn't want to sacrifice handling.   It's a 6-series or CLS with rear headroom and enough space for some luggage.   In terms of space, it's a bit like the old DTS, except now it has the agility of a 5-series or better. 

 

The article from Automobile ultimately says it's not a night and day difference though with the large luxo-barges as it should be.

 

Oh?  That wasn't my takeaway

 

 

 

Biggest surprise: the jewel in the new CT6 lineup is the rear-drive, turbo-four base car. This version feels distinctly different from its V-6, AWD siblings: it’s more agile, more fun, with livelier steering and an agreeable sizzle under the hood. Never expected it, but the bantam four-banger is amazingly refined and eager. You’ll smile as you gun this CT6 from corner to corner. You may even chortle. At $59,390 in Luxury trim, this version delivers value with a wallop. And it returns an estimated 22/31 city/highway mpg. Seriously, if you’re shopping for a CT6, don’t overlook the little guy.

 

Most likely, it's just the suspension tuning on the platinum model. 

 

 

 

The PHEV drive train will have 335 hp:

 

http://www.hybridcars.com/gm-highlights-tech-details-for-its-quick-efficient-cadillac-ct6-phev/

 

 

IMO, this drive system should target those who want quiet delivery of lots of low end torque along with an interior that is luxurious. 

[Suaviloquent]

Everyone worth a dime was looking when the Ciel and El Miraj concepts came out.

 

It's now after the CT6 came out is where they're disgruntled at the wasted opportunity. They like the car.

 

And no, I think the S-Class is not a good value for money, and I don't particularly like anything about it, but I can readily admit, that the interior is rivaling the levels of Bentley and Rolls Royce. When you get to that point, you can charge a lot of money for it.

 

But I don't think Cadillac needs to be that way, but if the brand has prestige, then they should charge more than anyone else.

[Suaviloquent]

 

 

 

That's not the point. They saved no expense for the platform, but then when it came time to actually make the great dare, they floundered on the interior. Like I can't believe how we were all led to believe it would be the car to bring Cadillac to the top. It just isn't that car. And NO it does not rival an S-Class in any way, shape or form. The S-Class is just out of reach in every CT6 configuration. Unless they fix the interior, put back the same level of craftsmanship from the Fleetwood Brougham D'Elegance, and get the V8 back as well. 

 

 

 

Of course the first question I'd ask is if they do all those things.. will U ante up the base price of $90K to buy one? Doubt it.. for a bunch of reasons, but mostly because U are full of $h!. The CT6 is an S-Class competitor where it counts.. and for someone to say that it can't compete because of a few minor details, when the $25K+ price difference is brought into play is ridiculous and quite frankly stupid. (The last part because I think U suck.. and U are a f@#kin blowhard.)

 

The V8 availability... is the only thing U say that has any validity. The interesting part is that my top of the line CTS has as nice of an interior as the S-Class, and addresses the issues in the interior of the less expensive CT6 that U speak. But alas.. there is the solution, and the issue; Should Cadillac had come right out the box with CTS-V (read $10K-35K more) type amenities in a car that had to prove itself.. or waited one year and put out a new V8 encased in the car that was on the market already SHOWING AND PROVING?

 

 

Insulting me won't win you any points. I think many Cadillac fans are ultimately blind as to how the firm can actually capture people who don't like the firm. The only thing that would make tehm show respect is complete dominance, even in the interior.

 

I love Cadillac. But it's stupid people who think Cadillac has bottled lightning that need to realize the most advanced chassis in the world won't save them from ultimate scrutiny over the interior. That and before JD came in it was promised it would defy all critics.

 

The price difference isn't the point, genius. I want Cadillac to CHARGE MORE. (READ THAT AGAIN) CHARGE MORE THAN MERCEDES, and while matching or exceeding that interior. And it can't even match it, at any price or trim level. Your top of the line CTS does not have as nice an interior as an S-Class. Damn well an Audi A6 is better. And no, you're opinion ain't worth jack $h!, because Cadillac should NEVER be a value for money company. They should just be the standard that no one can beat. It's that kind of thinking, that will lead Cadillac to success. But they have to have the best of everything. I think a separate engine family is just politically driven, has no basis if they judge the merits of their premium V8 already used in the Escalade. 

 

 

And anyhow, there's a huge marketing gamble, when someone proclaims their product to be world best but then charges bargain basement prices for it. Everyone knows that. 

 

 

 

Insulting U is my sport of the today.. cause its raining geni.. no jack-ass. The idea in your head that charging more means best shows me that U really are naive. What makes it worse is that in your mind having the more advanced chassis in the world is second to having a leather cap over the airbag. Personally I would have no issue at all if the already stellar Alpha chassis under my CTS was given up for the, by your own admission, most advanced chassis in the world sitting under the CT6.. and all I had to do is give up.. the leather cap on my steering while and take a rubberized one. 

 

Yeah, and then you're the one who cries about ATP being the measure of the strength of the brand. Sheesh. And where's the value of the advanced chassis for a luxury standpoint? Tell me? Give me some damn benefits a mogul will get if he/she is sitting in the back, lounging.

 

The CT6 interior can only match up to even a Hyundai Genesis G90, let alone an S-Class, an any way. 

 

 

I'll continue to point of Cadillac flaws, only because I want them to crush everyone else. Cadillac can only do justice to itself, if they go beyond the value for money kind of thinking. A luxury car is an emotional purchase, NOT a rational one. And the Mercedes interior, it's worth every penny above the CT6. Because that's how good it really is. Does it make it a better car? Not for the money. But is it the better luxury saloon? Absolutely. But being able to stomach the price is the price of admission.

 

Besides, if Cadillac had the S-Class pat on the interior, and had the LT1 under the hood, and charged more than the S-Class...suddenlly that's a bad thing. Oh wait...where's my "insert how valuable ATPs are" comment? 

[Suaviloquent]

The mission of the CT6 changed part of the way through.... and when Cadillac does to an S-class level car, they'll still use the same platform most likely.

 

The CT6 is a driver's car for someone who wants a big car but doesn't want to sacrifice handling.   It's a 6-series or CLS with rear headroom and enough space for some luggage.   In terms of space, it's a bit like the old DTS, except now it has the agility of a 5-series or better. 

 

It's the onus on Cadillac to prove how that is a benefit for someone buying a large sedan like that. 

 

That part is not going to be readily accepted, instead, the CT6 will default back to how it is a very nice large sedan, and is reasonably priced.

[Cmicasa the Great]

Everyone worth a dime was looking when the Ciel and El Miraj concepts came out.

 

It's now after the CT6 came out is where they're disgruntled at the wasted opportunity. They like the car.

 

And no, I think the S-Class is not a good value for money, and I don't particularly like anything about it, but I can readily admit, that the interior is rivaling the levels of Bentley and Rolls Royce. When you get to that point, you can charge a lot of money for it.

 

But I don't think Cadillac needs to be that way, but if the brand has prestige, then they should charge more than anyone else.

 

 

How well engineered was the Ciel?? The ElMiraj?? I ask because putting a car body on a particular chassis, without issue, is not as easy as one may think. At what point was it not made clear that they were both styling exercises to usher in .. well new styling? The Ciel is the concept car of what the CT6, XT5, Escalade.. and CTS, f would look like, sans the convertible top. The ElMiraj is the next phase.. unless the new head of Global Design changes something.

 

 

AND HOLD THE HELL UP!!! Are U telling me that U believe that the S550.. because that's what I've been saying all along (not the S63 or S65) has an interior on par with the RR Ghost.. or the Bentley Continental???

 

Have U ever been in any of the three.. in recent years??? 

 

 

Dude.. just  U're done

[Cmicasa the Great]

 

 

 

The mission of the CT6 changed part of the way through.... and when Cadillac does to an S-class level car, they'll still use the same platform most likely.

 

The CT6 is a driver's car for someone who wants a big car but doesn't want to sacrifice handling.   It's a 6-series or CLS with rear headroom and enough space for some luggage.   In terms of space, it's a bit like the old DTS, except now it has the agility of a 5-series or better. 

 

The article from Automobile ultimately says it's not a night and day difference though with the large luxo-barges as it should be.

 

Oh?  That wasn't my takeaway

 

 

 

Biggest surprise: the jewel in the new CT6 lineup is the rear-drive, turbo-four base car. This version feels distinctly different from its V-6, AWD siblings: it’s more agile, more fun, with livelier steering and an agreeable sizzle under the hood. Never expected it, but the bantam four-banger is amazingly refined and eager. You’ll smile as you gun this CT6 from corner to corner. You may even chortle. At $59,390 in Luxury trim, this version delivers value with a wallop. And it returns an estimated 22/31 city/highway mpg. Seriously, if you’re shopping for a CT6, don’t overlook the little guy.

 

Most likely, it's just the suspension tuning on the platinum model. 

 

 

 

The PHEV drive train will have 335 hp:

 

http://www.hybridcars.com/gm-highlights-tech-details-for-its-quick-efficient-cadillac-ct6-phev/

 

 

IMO, this drive system should target those who want quiet delivery of lots of low end torque along with an interior that is luxurious. 

 

 

 

I think this is partially the case.. the thing is that at the price point the PHEV must come in at.. the amenities will have to be upped a bit to justify the price further.

[Suaviloquent]

 

Everyone worth a dime was looking when the Ciel and El Miraj concepts came out.

 

It's now after the CT6 came out is where they're disgruntled at the wasted opportunity. They like the car.

 

And no, I think the S-Class is not a good value for money, and I don't particularly like anything about it, but I can readily admit, that the interior is rivaling the levels of Bentley and Rolls Royce. When you get to that point, you can charge a lot of money for it.

 

But I don't think Cadillac needs to be that way, but if the brand has prestige, then they should charge more than anyone else.

 

 

How well engineered was the Ciel?? The ElMiraj?? At what point was it not made clear that they were both styling exercises to usher in .. well new styling? The Ciel is the concept car of what the CT6, XT5, Escalade.. and CTS, f would look like, sans the convertible top. The ElMiraj is the next phase.. unless the new head of Global Design changes something.

 

 

AND HOLD THE f@#k UP!!! Are U telling me that U believe that the S550.. because that's what I've been saying all along (not the S63 or S65) has an interior on par with the RR Ghost.. or the Bentley Continental???

 

Have U ever been in any of the three.. in recent years??? 

 

 

Dude.. just I'm done

 

 

Those aren't my words, they're from the auto media that gets to spend time in all those vehicles. No, it doesn't beat them. But it's sure as hell closer to them, than the Cadillac is closer to it.

 

And  no one gives two $h!s on what platform or how well engineered those cars would have been if that kind of exacting styling, save for the fancy concept headlights were production vehicles.

 

An El Miraj sedan would be beautiful, and worthy of being priced into the stratosphere. And now such a vehicle is up in the wind.

 

Look, here's an example. Lexus had that coupe concept, and the production vehicle looks exactly like it, except the interior is closer to reality, but still off the charts in terms of how it reproduces the vision of the concept. Why couldn't Cadillac wait just a bit longer to get there?

 

It's not like anyone will beat Cadillac on lightweighting anytime soon. The 7 Series has to use carbon fibre, and it still can't match the CT6. 

[surreal1272]

Everyone worth a dime was looking when the Ciel and El Miraj concepts came out.

 

It's now after the CT6 came out is where they're disgruntled at the wasted opportunity. They like the car.

 

And no, I think the S-Class is not a good value for money, and I don't particularly like anything about it, but I can readily admit, that the interior is rivaling the levels of Bentley and Rolls Royce. When you get to that point, you can charge a lot of money for it.

 

But I don't think Cadillac needs to be that way, but if the brand has prestige, then they should charge more than anyone else.

 

 

How well engineered was the Ciel?? The ElMiraj?? At what point was it not made clear that they were both styling exercises to usher in .. well new styling? The Ciel is the concept car of what the CT6, XT5, Escalade.. and CTS, f would look like, sans the convertible top. The ElMiraj is the next phase.. unless the new head of Global Design changes something.

 

 

AND HOLD THE f@#k UP!!! Are U telling me that U believe that the S550.. because that's what I've been saying all along (not the S63 or S65) has an interior on par with the RR Ghost.. or the Bentley Continental???

 

Have U ever been in any of the three.. in recent years??? 

 

 

Dude.. just I'm done

 

Those aren't my words, they're from the auto media that gets to spend time in all those vehicles. No, it doesn't beat them. But it's sure as hell closer to them, than the Cadillac is closer to it.

 

And  no one gives two $h!s on what platform or how well engineered those cars would have been if that kind of exacting styling, save for the fancy concept headlights were production vehicles.

 

An El Miraj sedan would be beautiful, and worthy of being priced into the stratosphere. And now such a vehicle is up in the wind.

 

Look, here's an example. Lexus had that coupe concept, and the production vehicle looks exactly like it, except the interior is closer to reality, but still off the charts in terms of how it reproduces the vision of the concept. Why couldn't Cadillac wait just a bit longer to get there?

 

It's not like anyone will beat Cadillac on lightweighting anytime soon. The 7 Series has to use carbon fibre, and it still can't match the CT6.

While you're here spitting venom about the CT6, I can only see the blatant double standard in your arguments. If you don't believe me, please reference your endless defense in the Continental thread while giving everyone else hell who dared to criticize it.

Just saying. What goes around truly comes around.

[Suaviloquent]

 

 

 

Everyone worth a dime was looking when the Ciel and El Miraj concepts came out.

 

It's now after the CT6 came out is where they're disgruntled at the wasted opportunity. They like the car.

 

And no, I think the S-Class is not a good value for money, and I don't particularly like anything about it, but I can readily admit, that the interior is rivaling the levels of Bentley and Rolls Royce. When you get to that point, you can charge a lot of money for it.

 

But I don't think Cadillac needs to be that way, but if the brand has prestige, then they should charge more than anyone else.

 

 

How well engineered was the Ciel?? The ElMiraj?? At what point was it not made clear that they were both styling exercises to usher in .. well new styling? The Ciel is the concept car of what the CT6, XT5, Escalade.. and CTS, f would look like, sans the convertible top. The ElMiraj is the next phase.. unless the new head of Global Design changes something.

 

 

AND HOLD THE f@#k UP!!! Are U telling me that U believe that the S550.. because that's what I've been saying all along (not the S63 or S65) has an interior on par with the RR Ghost.. or the Bentley Continental???

 

Have U ever been in any of the three.. in recent years??? 

 

 

Dude.. just I'm done

 

Those aren't my words, they're from the auto media that gets to spend time in all those vehicles. No, it doesn't beat them. But it's sure as hell closer to them, than the Cadillac is closer to it.

 

And  no one gives two $h!s on what platform or how well engineered those cars would have been if that kind of exacting styling, save for the fancy concept headlights were production vehicles.

 

An El Miraj sedan would be beautiful, and worthy of being priced into the stratosphere. And now such a vehicle is up in the wind.

 

Look, here's an example. Lexus had that coupe concept, and the production vehicle looks exactly like it, except the interior is closer to reality, but still off the charts in terms of how it reproduces the vision of the concept. Why couldn't Cadillac wait just a bit longer to get there?

 

It's not like anyone will beat Cadillac on lightweighting anytime soon. The 7 Series has to use carbon fibre, and it still can't match the CT6.

While you're here spitting venom about the CT6, I can only see the blatant double standard in your arguments. If you don't believe me, please reference your endless defense in the Continental thread while giving everyone else hell who dared to criticize it.

Just saying. What goes around truly comes around.

 

 

I still like the CT6 way more than the Conti.

 

Besides, I still believe that handling at the limit is the last priority of anyone buying a large sedan. Especially Cadillac large sedans, given the vast history and most recently the XTS. And the Conti is a wallflower against an S-Class.

 

There is no double standard. 

 

I wasn't giving hell. I was trying to coax a reasonable argument as to why anyone should care about driving dynamics in such large as hell sedans. From a luxury only standpoint, it's just a non-factor.

 

And then if some GM fans started saying suddenly the CT6 is actually competitive interior-wise against the S-Class, they're patently wrong. Heck, ccap mentioned the comment how the CT6 is not going to match up to an S-Class. Which is what I'm trying to get inside the head of the staunch GM fan. 

 

Go ahead, rail against the Conti how it's not a sports sedan, something that Lincoln mentioned 5 months ago.

[surreal1272]

Everyone worth a dime was looking when the Ciel and El Miraj concepts came out.

It's now after the CT6 came out is where they're disgruntled at the wasted opportunity. They like the car.

And no, I think the S-Class is not a good value for money, and I don't particularly like anything about it, but I can readily admit, that the interior is rivaling the levels of Bentley and Rolls Royce. When you get to that point, you can charge a lot of money for it.

But I don't think Cadillac needs to be that way, but if the brand has prestige, then they should charge more than anyone else.

How well engineered was the Ciel?? The ElMiraj?? At what point was it not made clear that they were both styling exercises to usher in .. well new styling? The Ciel is the concept car of what the CT6, XT5, Escalade.. and CTS, f would look like, sans the convertible top. The ElMiraj is the next phase.. unless the new head of Global Design changes something.

AND HOLD THE f@#k UP!!! Are U telling me that U believe that the S550.. because that's what I've been saying all along (not the S63 or S65) has an interior on par with the RR Ghost.. or the Bentley Continental???

Have U ever been in any of the three.. in recent years???

Dude.. just I'm done

Those aren't my words, they're from the auto media that gets to spend time in all those vehicles. No, it doesn't beat them. But it's sure as hell closer to them, than the Cadillac is closer to it.

And no one gives two $h!s on what platform or how well engineered those cars would have been if that kind of exacting styling, save for the fancy concept headlights were production vehicles.

An El Miraj sedan would be beautiful, and worthy of being priced into the stratosphere. And now such a vehicle is up in the wind.

Look, here's an example. Lexus had that coupe concept, and the production vehicle looks exactly like it, except the interior is closer to reality, but still off the charts in terms of how it reproduces the vision of the concept. Why couldn't Cadillac wait just a bit longer to get there?

It's not like anyone will beat Cadillac on lightweighting anytime soon. The 7 Series has to use carbon fibre, and it still can't match the CT6.

While you're here spitting venom about the CT6, I can only see the blatant double standard in your arguments. If you don't believe me, please reference your endless defense in the Continental thread while giving everyone else hell who dared to criticize it.

Just saying. What goes around truly comes around.

I still like the CT6 way more than the Conti.

Besides, I still believe that handling at the limit is the last priority of anyone buying a large sedan. Especially Cadillac large sedans, given the vast history and most recently the XTS. And the Conti is a wallflower against an S-Class.

There is no double standard.

I wasn't giving hell. I was trying to coax a reasonable argument as to why anyone should care about driving dynamics in such large as hell sedans. From a luxury only standpoint, it's just a non-factor.

And then if some GM fans started saying suddenly the CT6 is actually competitive interior-wise against the S-Class, they're patently wrong. Heck, ccap mentioned the comment how the CT6 is not going to match up to an S-Class. Which is what I'm trying to get inside the head of the staunch GM fan.

Go ahead, rail against the Conti how it's not a sports sedan, something that Lincoln mentioned 5 months ago.

Sorry but after reading through your posts on this thread, I see nothing "reasonable" in most of your arguments. More like lashing out (and this was before Casas insults).

Btw, that last bit about the Conti proves my point.

Edited May 11, 2016 by surreal1272

[surreal1272]

I'm just going to leave this right here.

[Suaviloquent]

Yeah, the Escalade interior is quite nice.

 

But it just doesn't carry over to the CT6, IMO.

[ccap41]

Somebody turn the defroster on inside of that CT6.. looks a little misty in there!

 

The only thing I don't like about that S Class pic is the GLOSSY wood. 

 

Style and looks-wise I think they are on par with each other because that is all personal preference how things are laid out and where controls and vents are. One could very well think the monster screens and circle vents look way better and classier on the S Class and vise versa. 

 

Look how much wider the center console is on the CT6 rather than the S Class. Is that extra space in the S Class in a wider seat? or is the CT6 rocking narrower seats? Orrrr is the CT6 actually wider than the S Class? Or another variation because there are all sorts of combos with those three scenarios.

 

Edit: WHOOPS!!! I didn't realize that was an Escalade interior.. 

Edited May 11, 2016 by ccap41

[surreal1272]

Oops. Posted the Slade by mistake. Here we go.

Edited May 11, 2016 by surreal1272

[Cmicasa the Great]

I'm just going to leave this right here.

image.jpeg

image.jpeg

 

 

 

IMO... and after being in both.. the Cadillac interior comes off as not only looking more quality but also  richer, with a few minor things in favor of the Benz.. The CT6 P, in my opinion, is on par with the S-Class with exception to a few little things that STILL don't justify a $10K price difference. It reeally is the same argument someone could make between the 911 Carar and the Corvette. Some things are just perception.. and admittedly perception is in Benz's favor right now. Personally I see zero about them to justify a $10K price difference in these two cars.. and I challenge anyone to pull up in either, as the average luxury buyer which costs the most based on the interior.. and not get an answer that goes in favor of the Americans. Of course I don't judge a luxury car based solely on the leather on the Airbag cover.. but the who package.

[Suaviloquent]

It's a veritable fact that the CT6 does not have an interior to match the Mercedes S-Class. That's not subject to debate.

 

I will also argue that the S-Class is a poor value for money, but Cadillac perhaps doesn't need to be a value of money kind of luxury brand either.

 

I think Cadillac can easily close the gap with Mercedes, and if they wanted to still undercut the Mercedes or anyone else by a fair amount. But since they want organic growth, I think that isn't something that needs to manifest itself.

[surreal1272]

It's a veritable fact that the CT6 does not have an interior to match the Mercedes S-Class. That's not subject to debate.

 

I will also argue that the S-Class is a poor value for money, but Cadillac perhaps doesn't need to be a value of money kind of luxury brand either.

 

I think Cadillac can easily close the gap with Mercedes, and if they wanted to still undercut the Mercedes or anyone else by a fair amount. But since they want organic growth, I think that isn't something that needs to manifest itself.

What verifiable fact? The only one who has been saying that it doesn't has been you. Also, if you had actually paid attention to the very first post comparing the two, you would have seen that they were referring to a base model S Class versus a platinum CT6, of which the latter DOES compare to. Not saying it is better but to act like it doesn't compare on some level because you say it doesnt, does not mean it is true. That is what you are not getting here.