Why GM should NOT build a DOHC V8

[oldshurst442]

Honestly, you really have to be an ignorant fanboy to argue pushrod is better than OHC. Period.

 

Honestly, If one REALLY wants to be honest about it.....

One has to weigh all the positives and all the negatives of BOTH and one has to consider what is his engineering requirements before one makes a conclusion...and not a conclusion of what argument  of which is better than the other...but a conclusion of what works BEST for YOUR ENGINEERING REQUIREMENTS....

 

When one does not look at it that way, one is ignorant no matter what type of fanboy one is...

I dont want to insult you or nuthin', but that what you just spew ......was one ignorant statement.  PERIOD.

Edited May 18, 2016 by oldshurst442

[oldshurst442]

 

Honestly, you really have to be an ignorant fanboy to argue pushrod is better than OHC. Period.

 

Honestly, If one REALLY wants to be honest about it.....

One has to weigh all the positives and all the negatives of BOTH and one has to consider what is his engineering requirements before one makes a conclusion...and not a conclusion of what argument  of which is better than the other...but a conclusion of what works BEST for YOUR ENGINEERING REQUIREMENTS....

 

When one does not look at it that way, one is ignorant no matter what type of fanboy one is...

I dont want to insult you or nuthin', but that what you just spew ......was one ignorant statement.  PERIOD.

I know one thing buddy...

That pushrods work damn well for Chevrolet...in the context that Chevy uses them!!!

 

 

Hell...it even works DAMN well for Dodge

 

and the Hellcat for what Dodge wants it to be...

 

 

 

And if you want to deny any of that...

Ill just redirect you to YOUR comment.

 

Honestly, you really have to be an ignorant fanboy to argue......

 

 

 

 

[G. David Felt]

Love the Power of the Pushrod, truly an amazing engine.

[FordCosworth]

Love the power of OHC, truly an amazing engine ( design )...too

[Drew Dowdell]

DOHC only really helps a V configuration engine if you are displacement restricted.  If there is no restriction on displacement (government regulation, corporate edict) then the best way to get the most power is to fill the engine bay with as many cubic inches of displacement you can.... and the best way to do that is with pushrods.

[oldshurst442]

Love the power of OHC, truly an amazing engine ( design )...too

Dear Mr. FordCosworth,

 

  Is this post a simple case of whatever monkey see, monkey do?

  I mean, it bothers you soooooo much that a poster loves pushrods that you have to reciprocate a post like a child?

  Grow the phoque up!!!!

 

OHC and OHV engines exist...and both do a fine job when engineers make them do those special things that they do when engineers get their calculations right..and MY statement applies to BOTH OHC and OHV engines.... and they CAN co-exist without you trolling....

 

I mean....can YOU exist at CheersandGears without the dumb childish responses?

You actually have a lot to offer....like Wings....but you wreck it with your trolling...just like Wings...

 

Do we really need to read your childish antics everytime there is a post that goes against your logic?

Because...while the ignore feature is available to all of us to use....you too, could use the ignore feature and ignore all that oppose YOUR logic...

 

Because, the way I figure it...why should I be the one to use the ignore feature...it seems that YOU are the one that gets irked when someone goes against YOUR logic....so logically speaking....so we could avoid childish posts....USE THE IGNORE FEATURE SO YOU DONT HAVE TO READ THE POSTERS THAT ARE OPPOSITE OF YOU...and that way, all of your posts will be insightful...hopefully...

[rougeriver]

DOHC only really helps a V configuration engine if you are displacement restricted.  If there is no restriction on displacement (government regulation, corporate edict) then the best way to get the most power is to fill the engine bay with as many cubic inches of displacement you can.... and the best way to do that is with pushrods.

 

One can get more cylinder volume per dressed weight and and external dimensions, thus being able to make up for less HP/L. The icing on the cake is that two valve heads tend to flow better at low rpms; that combined with more displacement gives more area under the torque curve in the rpm range that engines spend most of their time. I never had anything against pushrod engines. 

[Drew Dowdell]

 

DOHC only really helps a V configuration engine if you are displacement restricted.  If there is no restriction on displacement (government regulation, corporate edict) then the best way to get the most power is to fill the engine bay with as many cubic inches of displacement you can.... and the best way to do that is with pushrods.

 

One can get more cylinder volume per dressed weight and and external dimensions, thus being able to make up for less HP/L. The icing on the cake is that two valve heads tend to flow better at low rpms; that combined with more displacement gives more area under the torque curve in the rpm range that engines spend most of their time. I never had anything against pushrod engines. 

 

 

Exactly.... even my '81 Oldsmobile feels quick off the line.  It's only a 3-speed auto, so max 0-60 isn't up to modern standards, but in typical traffic I move along just fine without a struggle.  Double the number of gears (or more) and that old engine with 140ish horsepower would probably move the car along very nicely.... and why? Because it has 255 lb-ft of torque at about 1500 rpm. That's more torque than nearly all modern non-turbo DOHC V6es see period... and those that do exceed that torque spec don't do it till they've hit 5 times the RPM of my 307. 

 

HP/L is just about the dumbest metric we've ever had for passenger cars and everyone is worse off for the industry moving in that direction.

[rougeriver]

 

 

DOHC only really helps a V configuration engine if you are displacement restricted.  If there is no restriction on displacement (government regulation, corporate edict) then the best way to get the most power is to fill the engine bay with as many cubic inches of displacement you can.... and the best way to do that is with pushrods.

 

One can get more cylinder volume per dressed weight and and external dimensions, thus being able to make up for less HP/L. The icing on the cake is that two valve heads tend to flow better at low rpms; that combined with more displacement gives more area under the torque curve in the rpm range that engines spend most of their time. I never had anything against pushrod engines. 

 

 

Exactly.... even my '81 Oldsmobile feels quick off the line.  It's only a 3-speed auto, so max 0-60 isn't up to modern standards, but in typical traffic I move along just fine without a struggle.  Double the number of gears (or more) and that old engine with 140ish horsepower would probably move the car along very nicely.... and why? Because it has 255 lb-ft of torque at about 1500 rpm. That's more torque than nearly all modern non-turbo DOHC V6es see period... and those that do exceed that torque spec don't do it till they've hit 5 times the RPM of my 307. 

 

HP/L is just about the dumbest metric we've ever had for passenger cars and everyone is worse off for the industry moving in that direction.

 

 

My 1989 Mustang GT with those primitive cast iron truck heads made 300lbs @ 3,200 and that engine had no problem staying in the tallest ratio going up grades on the Pa Turnpike while turning less than 2000 rpms. 

 

I like engines wherein the torque number is a bit lopsided with respect to horsepower. 

[G. David Felt]

And that is where Marketing has FAILED the consumer. They only talk about HP and ignor that Torque is what is needed to move you along while HP is there to sustain it at the high end of speed.

 

EV motors giving 100% Torque and HP or better Kilowatts / Megawatts give it all from ZERO and keep 100% up to red line thus giving a very nice experience. I totally expect the BOLT to suprise many when it hits the lots this fall / winter.

[Cmicasa the Great]

And really... the CTS-V engine is far superior to the M5 or E-AMG in power... and not just by a little bit... there are significant power advantages in the CTS-V.

 

 

 

I concur. The CTS-V's LT4 simply put.. has power down low and keeps gaining and gaining as U push down the pedal. Cadillac also did a fantastic job at mapping the throttle to assist in this. What makes it even more fantastic is that U can still ride around in this car (in Touring Mode) and with all of that power at your beckon call.. and never feel like things are going to get out of hand if some idiot in a Mustang GT realizes what U have,, and starts reving his engine. U can beat the $h! out of him..and never once have gone past the half way mark blipping pedal. I've done this with out any wheel spin as well. Quite remarkable, and if the car was AWD.. land lighter using the Omega platform.. U would see under 2.8 second 0-60 times all day long I mean seriously.. the numbers speak for themselves.. and only a Ford or Foreign car lover would try to argue that the Pushrod.. a technically newer design than OHC, is some how inferior.

 

BTW.. if U guys get one to test.. try the Launch control function.. it is quite easy to use and simply requires U put her in Track mode.. hold the brake firm.. push the pedal to 1500 and then release.. awaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay U go

 

[ccap41]

This might seem like a stupid question and I apologize for it not being in the right thread but why do they even make a middle seat in the back of cars like the CTS-V or CTS/5 Series, E Class, A6? Is that an actual usable seat? I mean I know a teen and younger CAN fit there but even sitting "bitch" in a large Yukon or Traverse sucks and I assume those are at least a little wider than those sporty sedans, right? They should just make the rear seats a little more bucket-like and maybe some form of permanent console-like thing in the middle. Even if it is just a solid arm rest of something I think that would be more useful and look better than a pull-down arm rest that they probably have now.

 

Just an idea/curious. 

[Cmicasa the Great]

Honestly.. I could care less how comfy someone is in my car.. if they have that much of an issue sitting back there.. they can get their asses out and walk. f@#k 'em

[oldshurst442]

Honestly.. I could care less how comfy someone is in my car.. if they have that much of an issue sitting back there.. they can get their asses out and walk. f@#k 'em

Well, I almost agree to that.

 

If its free loafing dimwits that Im transporting, then I agree 100%.

But if its my kids..sure kids tend to be free loafers too, but...hey...they are MY kids....

 

With that being said...I dont hang around moochers any more.....I put those freaks aside a decade ago plus when I decided to get married....

And now, its only my wife and kids in my life that Im with every single second that I can....which means, the cars that I tend to buy, need to be 100% comfortable for everybody anywhere in the car...

 

And hence why the 2012 Buick Regal GS lost out to the 2012 Acura TL SH-AWD...

And hence why the 2013 Buick Verano lost to the 2013 Ford Fusion.

 

Two sales that would have other wise gone to Buick.

I LOVED the Regal as much as the TL...the Acura did have a naturally aspirated 300 horse V6 going for it too though....I LOVE me some V6 engines sometimes...

My wife LOVED the Verano as much as the Fusion....but when discussing which car best suits her needs, she already had a Mazda 3...which was slightly less tight mind you than the Verano, we went for the Fusion instead...

Edited May 20, 2016 by oldshurst442

[chuckat]

Reciprocating mass. That's the reason that DOHC exists. Everything else is setup. Pushrods are cheap and that's a good thing. It all depends on what you are trying to do.

[Drew Dowdell]

1 hour ago, chuckat said:

Reciprocating mass. That's the reason that DOHC exists. Everything else is setup. Pushrods are cheap and that's a good thing. It all depends on what you are trying to do.

That’s mostly important in high rpm engines. In 5 or 6 liter V8s there’s no real benefit on that part.