Luxury cars

[Camino LS6]

Yup, a curse.

Let me explain.

I have never thought much of luxury cars - they just aren't my thing. And, now that performance has become so closely associated with luxury, non-luxury performance cars are nearly extinct.

Ticks me off.

[CaddyXLR-V]

Yup, a curse.

Let me explain.

I have never thought much of luxury cars - they just aren't my thing. And, now that performance has become so closely associated with luxury, non-luxury performance cars are nearly extinct.

Ticks me off.

I was just thinking the same thing.

If you want a car with performance, you have to put up over $50,000, and take all the extra stuff you don't need or want with it.

If I want a mid-size rwd car with good performance, my choices are 330Ci or IS350. I want something for under $30,000.

[CaddyXLR-V]

Another thing, I think part of the reason GM's decision about Pontiac ticks me off so much, is because it is like GM is abandoning affordable performance cars. Chevy doesn't have the floor space for more cars, and I don't buy into the idea of sporty Buicks. Pontiac just happens to be my favorite brand, and seems like the best outlet for the cars I desire, and fits with their traditional image of offering performance.

[FloydHendershot]

Oldsmobile (buick to a slightly lesser extent) was brilliant at that.

Some might blame the 'rags'. I don't blame anyone but unquestionably agree. I think some equate performance/sportiness with safety.

[Camino LS6]

I need some choices, and there really aren't any these days.

I want the equivalent of my GTO in coupe,convertible,wagon, or Ute form.

Or some other less common bodystyle.

The GTO was just the right size.

[CaddyXLR-V]

I need some choices, and there really aren't any these days.

I want the equivalent of my GTO in coupe,convertible,wagon, or Ute form.

Or some other less common bodystyle.

The GTO was just the right size.

I agree the GTO is just the right size, I just wish it weighed about 400lbs less. Although it doesn't feel like it weighs 3800lbs, I imagine it would handle so much better and be a lot quicker if it weighed only 3400lbs.

The 330Ci is roughly the same size, maybe slightly smaller, but I can't justify spending over $50,000 on it.

[SoCalCTS]

GM has two great choices for you: The G8 and the Camaro. wait is the G8 a coupe? okay scratch that... the solstice coupe and the camaro.

These are definitely not luxurious at all. Great performance with a Spartan interior.

Edited April 10, 2009 by SoCalCTS

[Camino LS6]

GM has two great choices for you: The G8 and the Camaro. wait is the G8 a coupe? okay scratch that... the solstice coupe and the camaro.

These are definitely not luxurious at all. Great performance with a Spartan interior.

Solstice = too small

Camaro = too small (inside)+ too common

I want something different.

[CaddyXLR-V]

GM has to great choices for you: The G8 and the Camaro.

These are definitely not luxurious at all. Great performance with a Spartan interior.

Still too heavy, I like the G8 interior, don't like the retro interior of the Chevy, and just plain don't want a Chevy.

I would like a G8 if it came in coupe form. Though I wish the base V8 had 400hp like my GTO, without having to pay $10k extra to get the GXP. Otherwise it seems like a step backwards for me.

Ideally, I want something with the same power or less weight, or the same weight with more power. Both the Camaro and G8 are heavier than my car.

[Camino LS6]

I agree the GTO is just the right size, I just wish it weighed about 400lbs less. Although it doesn't feel like it weighs 3800lbs, I imagine it would handle so much better and be a lot quicker if it weighed only 3400lbs.

The 330Ci is roughly the same size, maybe slightly smaller, but I can't justify spending over $50,000 on it.

I always felt a bit cramped in 3 series cars - not terrible, just a bit narrow and confining.

[CaddyXLR-V]

I always felt a bit cramped in 3 series cars - not terrible, just a bit narrow and confining.

You do make some good points. The GTO backseat is comfortable, once you get back there. The car is wide. It just needs to lose some lbs not by shrinking, but with some lighter materials. The Camaro is wide, but the backseat wont be nearly as spacious, and is still heavier.

There is nothing out there that is compelling to current GTO owners. Everything seems like a step back in one way or another.

[Camino LS6]

There is nothing out there that is compelling to current GTO owners. Everything seems like a step back in one way or another.

True.

Hadn't quite thought of it that way, but you are spot on.

[§carlet §wordfish]

The rub is, if you want something to be unique or uncommon, that means it has to be bought by fewer people. And if you want it to be inexpensive, that means the company is selling not many of a car that isn't making them as much money.

[Camino LS6]

The rub is, if you want something to be unique or uncommon, that means it has to be bought by fewer people. And if you want it to be inexpensive, that means the company is selling not many of a car that isn't making them as much money.

Which is why I bitch about sedans so much. I would be much easier to do something interesting if done as a variant of a higher volume sedan.

Variety at a reasonable price for both manufacturer and buyer.

[Justin Bimmer]

Today, even non-luxury performance cars like the Challenger an the Camaro are not cheap. The only time I see the Challenger driving around is near my house where people can afford the GT40 and Deloreans and god knows what else. But, it is a bad ass looking car. Very popular in Fresno. In the last 3 days I have seen 8.

[Camino LS6]

True.

I guess that's part of the problem, performance has become an exclusive for the higher end of the market.

Annoying.

[balthazar]

That's what vintage is for, Camino. Do whatever you want with nearly no restrictions, but generally less money invested. Lemmee guess- just done with one project- not looking for another. Granted. But you could always have one built for you for relatively reasonable money, no?

[Camino LS6]

That's what vintage is for, Camino. Do whatever you want with nearly no restrictions, but generally less money invested. Lemmee guess- just done with one project- not looking for another. Granted. But you could always have one built for you for relatively reasonable money, no?

Agreed.

If it weren't for vintage, I'd have no outlet for the frustrations i have with current offerings.

But shouldn't I have something that fits the bill in the sea of new cars?

So many nameplates, yet so little variation.

The realities of a generic present, I guess.

[Camino LS6]

Hell!

There was once more variation just within GM than there is in the entire market today!

Even with so many more players in the game.

[Intrepidation]

Challenger?

[Camino LS6]

Challenger?

Still the frontrunner...

[Intrepidation]

One of the problems is that when automakers create something different, not enough people buy them. Case in point: the Magnum. It was the hot rod of wagons...nothing looked like it. It offered RWD, V6 or V8 powertrains in a full size package. It got rave reviews from the press.

Chrysler killed it because not enough people could part with their oversized SUVs and buy one.

[Camino LS6]

The masses follow a lame mentality.

It disgusts me.

[balthazar]

>>"So many nameplates, yet so little variation. The realities of a generic present"<<

And you've nutshelled it neatly, perfectly, even. More & more & more of exactly the same, with less variation.

Used to be each nameplate had a recognized design language- toss a door on the ground and you knew what it was off of. Now, due to crash- & aero-restrictions, design is on life support & fading fast. The foreign brands have doubled & tripled their nameplates, each attempting to carve their own niche, everyone is begging for even more brands to come here and every one is building 3 & 4 versions of the same vehicle... yet everything looks like everything else. DEPRESSING.

[knightfan26917]

If it weren't for vintage, I'd have no outlet for the frustrations i have with current offerings.

But shouldn't I have something that fits the bill in the sea of new cars?

So many nameplates, yet so little variation.

The realities of a generic present, I guess.

*nods*

Camino ... you know I'm with you on all of this.

I guess that is why it has been so hard to find a winter beater or a winter beater-road trip car.

Arg.

Cort | 35swm | "Mr Monte Carlo"."Mr Road Trip" | pig valve.pacemaker ...RT 66 = Sept 5-16, '09

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